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370 Hemi
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Location : Sagamore Hills, Ohio
Points : 3765
Posts : 36
Reputation : 59

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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeNovember 28th 2009, 4:59 pm

HiPwr wrote:
RIF. Reading Is Fun.

Well HiPwr,

We have just been approved as a new Vendor on this forum.

BND Automotive LLC.

The product that we were discussing earlier is the ACES IV Gasoline Formula.

I have been watching all the questions and answers on gasoline for our cars.

Many people on this forum are looking for more power without spending a lot more for fuel.

Before we can understand why ACES IV is important in your fuel, an appropriate understanding of "a few things" which determine what gives power in an engine :

We have to begin by understanding that all the horsepower our engines are ever going to produce are stored in the fuel that you use to produce it. All other components including intakes, cams, valves, compression ratios, computer tunes etc all are dependent on appropriate fuel(and lubrication).

It’s really that simple. The specific energy content of the air/fuel mixture and the length it burns is the key.

The more fuel energy your engine can EFFICIENTLY burn (read that utilize), the more power it will produce per given fuel charge. This is correct regardless of whether you are normally aspirated, turbocharged, or supercharged.

However, a lot of factors influence this fuel energy:

Gross volume, air/fuel ratio, density of the fuel mixture, completeness of vaporization as opposed to atomization, initial flame speed and WHERE the burn originates and how it swirls.

You’ll notice I didn’t mention the octane rating initially. The reason is that in and of itself, octane rating does nothing to improve power output!

All octane rating does is measure the ability of a fuel to resist pre-ignition (which differs from detonation which is caused by end gasses instead) in a higher compression engine.

Higher octane fuels allow the use of higher compression ratios, and THAT does produce more power. This is where the Diablo picks up some power because the engine can be tuned much closer to the compression ratio and it's utilization factor. ACES IV can advance the power even more using a Diablo as the fuel will reach longer power peaks. While an octane rating does influence flame speed, so do other factors.

Two of these other factors are:

Vaporization...this is just what it sounds like: how well is the fuel/air mixture dispersed at the point of ignition. (As ACES IV promotes molecular fuel balancing, a much more vaporized dispersed pattern emerges) Incompletely atomized fuel burns more slowly and mostly will not burn completely. (This is another the reason for 2 plugs in the Hemi)

It doesn’t do you any good if it isn’t completely consumed by the time the exhaust port opens.....(this is why ACES IV releases oxygen, hydrogen and nitrogen at exactly peak heat release for a much more complete burn before the exhaust stroke commenses.)

The better job you can do in getting a uniform dispersion of fuel in the incoming air, the more completely it will burn. This is also where ACES IV promotes ignition from the inside out which performs better than an outside in configuration.

Many people try to use oil based fuel additives to accomplish a better burn because they believe that it will reduce surface tension of gasoline, unfortunately petroleum oils commonly used in most all fuel additives have relatively high surface tension in solution with gasoline and so it actually inhibits the vaporization process hampering combustion. (Typically this is why people call most fuel additives "snake oil".)

Oil is the operative word here and why. Remember that if it is distilled out of crude oil and not included in either gasoline, diesel fuel, or jet kerosine, then it isn't good for the fuels in general and should not be added.

Gasoline, diesel fuel, and jet kerosine are the most expensive components and any refinery would love to make full barrels of these three with nothing left over. If the item is distilled out then it is not good for any of them. However, there are bottles of "petroleum distillate" additives available to put in fuels because essentially they have to get rid of them somewhere!!

Flame speed is also pretty self-explanatory, but there are two sides to this coin. On one hand, the faster the fuel/air mixture burns, the higher expanding gas pressure will be and the longer the pressure wave will have to work on the piston before the exhaust port opens.

However, since the ignition system is timed to fire before the piston reaches top-dead-center, some of that gas pressure will actually work AGAINST the piston as it completes the compression stroke. It is called “knock" in your regular car, but it's really pre-ignition and it can be really destructive.

It can literally chew the top of a piston away a little bit at a time. In less then a minute, at the RPMs that most street/strip engines run the top of the piston is gone and youre done. In extreme cases, pre-ignition can break pistons, and the damage that it can do is expensive.

The density of the fuel/air mixture is the subject of a great deal of interest throughout the racing world. The cooler the charge of fuel and air going into the engine, the denser it will be. And the denser it is, the more potential energy there is in each incoming charge. Introducing more available oxygen and hydrogen with the fuel creates more power yet in the given space.

Remember that all the horsepower you’re going to get is stored in that fuel and air (especially with ACES IV), so the denser a charge you can get into the engine, the better. Superchargers and turbochargers increase the charge density mechanically by compressing it, but that generates a lot of heat in the mixture before it ever gets into the cylinder.

This is why lubricity is so important in post combustion to exhaust phase. It creates even more heat if nitrous oxide is used as an accelerant. (ACES IV makes nitrous about 7% more powerful)

With ACES IV, lengthing the flame front and retarding peak heat release will cause the fuel to resist pre-detonation and allow you to lean the engine out more without damage. The heat reactive lubricity produced by the ACES IV will reduce ring and bore wear by some 600% while reducing stem and guide wear by some 360%.

Use of ACES IV in 87 Octane fuel has an ignition improver to help increase 87 up to a 96 Octane effect (for low performance applications only, and not for high performance R/T and SRT8 use) smoother running and more mpg and less heat are produced.

Using it in 89 octane (for R/T and stock SRT8 applications) produces up to 98 Octane effect, and in 93 Octane fuel, effects of up to 102 Octane can be attained. Any base fuel, when treated, will help eliminate cylinder detonation and produce added power.

I use 89 Shell or Marathon fuels and ACES IV at 1 oz per 6 gallons in my 2006 Charger SRT8 to use the 98 octane effect with smooth power and no detonation in HP applications.

This is what we used when we went to Akron Horsepower along with the 12.5w40 QuantumBlue oils to get 19 hp and 31 ftlbs of torque.

Understanding the dynamics of how fuels work will help many people determine what is the next move, and how to get more power from your fuel effectively and why we designed the ACES IV the way we did.

Thanks

Brian
BND Automotive LLC
440-821-9040
www.bndautomotive.com
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Razcharged
CAMM Rookie


Location : Milwaukee
Points : 3586
Posts : 18
Reputation : 12

lucas oil products - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeApril 19th 2010, 8:09 am

Very good info!
I bought lucas products and didn't use them till about 6-8 years later!I had a rack-n-steering issue in my 2006 charger,I had a hard spot it was really hard to steer through it!
I hate to say it but drove it for over a week or so then found the rack steering oil from
Lucas in the garage and used it within a day it was gone and I drove it about 8 months to a year before I traded it in with no steering issue.
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Shawn1112
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Shawn1112

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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeApril 19th 2010, 8:16 am

Razcharged wrote:
Very good info!
I bought lucas products and didn't use them till about 6-8 years later!I had a rack-n-steering issue in my 2006 charger,I had a hard spot it was really hard to steer through it!
I hate to say it but drove it for over a week or so then found the rack steering oil from
Lucas in the garage and used it within a day it was gone and I drove it about 8 months to a year before I traded it in with no steering issue.
I heard someone else say the same exact thing. I think it was Jontoad, I might have to check this stuff out.

_________________
"Dont Talk About It, Be About It"
"Get In Where U Fit In"

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Razcharged
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Location : Milwaukee
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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeApril 19th 2010, 9:06 am

I couldn't get over I that it worked,I was shopping and researching how to do rack/steering and never did replace it!I was doing research even a week later cause I thought it would come back,never did!I for got I even had the problem till today!
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370 Hemi
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Location : Sagamore Hills, Ohio
Points : 3765
Posts : 36
Reputation : 59

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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeApril 19th 2010, 9:14 am

Razcharged wrote:
Very good info!
I bought lucas products and didn't use them till about 6-8 years later!I had a rack-n-steering issue in my 2006 charger,I had a hard spot it was really hard to steer through it!
I hate to say it but drove it for over a week or so then found the rack steering oil from
Lucas in the garage and used it within a day it was gone and I drove it about 8 months to a year before I traded it in with no steering issue.

Lucas stabilizer is made of a chemical called poly-iso-butylene. It a viscosity indexer that thickens up the ATF+4 making the pump work harder and isn't very good on the seals. Under the types of heat that your steering system encounters, the stabilizer literally wears out over a short period of time!

A much better way to go is to get the QuantumBlue Steering System Lubricant Catalyst. You use 2 oz per steering system. It permanently lubricates the centering bushing stopping morning sickness, conditions the seals on both sides of the rack, and lubricates the spool valve in the top part of the rack that contains the poly tetra fluoro ethylene (teflon type) seals from digging into the aluminum over time.

Here are a links to more info on it.

http://www.bndautomotive.com/page/page/931789.htm

http://www.chargerforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=105520

Regards,
Brian
BND Automotive LLC
440-821-9040
www.bndautomotive.com
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Razcharged
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Location : Milwaukee
Points : 3586
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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeApril 19th 2010, 9:44 am

Thanks again,faith in the unknown,we really don't know what were putting in our cars do we?that's why there's people like you that know what's going in our engines and people like me hunting a cheap easy fix but in turn hurting our cars!
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370 Hemi
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Location : Sagamore Hills, Ohio
Points : 3765
Posts : 36
Reputation : 59

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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeApril 19th 2010, 10:32 am

Razcharged wrote:
Thanks again,faith in the unknown,we really don't know what were putting in our cars do we?that's why there's people like you that know what's going in our engines and people like me hunting a cheap easy fix but in turn hurting our cars!

Well, that is the real problem. So many people believe the marketing and the hype of these companies. Those companies probably lose more money in one year by misplacing it than we probably make in 6 months anyway.

However, the thing that continues to differentiate us from the rest is that we have cogent information that is truly credible with verification, and also the personal experience with support of at least 1800+ owners of LX and LC cars with our technologies.

We also are LX enthusiasts that own them and work on them. Nothing is sold by our company until it meets our own OCD type standards. If it ain't good enough for our cars, it ain't good enough for yours.....that is really the best standard we can think of!

Look forward to working with you soon!

Regards,
Brian
BND Automotive LLC
440-821-9040
www.bndautomotive.com
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cjresto
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cjresto

Location : Tinley Park
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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeApril 19th 2010, 7:12 pm

HiPwr wrote:
This is the fuel additive I use: [url=http://www.bndautomotive.com/page/page/931760.htm
http://www.bndautomotive.com/page/page/931760.htm[/quote[/url]]

This is what I also use.
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370 Hemi
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Location : Sagamore Hills, Ohio
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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeApril 19th 2010, 10:57 pm

cjresto wrote:
HiPwr wrote:
This is the fuel additive I use: [url=http://www.bndautomotive.com/page/page/931760.htm
http://www.bndautomotive.com/page/page/931760.htm[/quote[/url]]

This is what I also use.

Try this link:

http://www.bndautomotive.com/page/page/931760.htm


Regards,

Brian
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Illinois Chaos
CAMM All-Star
Illinois Chaos

Location : in the other lane
Points : 12201
Posts : 5492
Reputation : 1198

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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeApril 20th 2010, 7:36 am

HiPwr wrote:
Shawn1112 wrote:
I remember reading something that said if you use 93octane, you dont need no fuel additive or cleaner.

I'd be interested in reading that because I don't believe it.

Additives in gas, only come in premium. Shell, Bp, Mobil have them for sure. Some gas does not, like Murphy Oil (Walmart) These additives are all done, by the gas co. from the rail cars as they come in from the refineries. I used to manage a gas station in 1970's. Occasionaly when my fuel tanker gas order would come in, the % of my order would be off. IE: more premium than mid grade, or not enough regular, etc. I had to decide whether or not to refuse it or more often than not I would ok dumping the extra % of ethyl or mid grade into the regular, and mid grade, but never the regular into mid grade or ethyl. When your selling 75-85,000 gpm, in the winter, and 135,000 in warm weather, you couldn't afford to run out.
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370 Hemi
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Location : Sagamore Hills, Ohio
Points : 3765
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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeApril 20th 2010, 8:21 am

Illinois Chaos wrote:
HiPwr wrote:
Shawn1112 wrote:
I remember reading something that said if you use 93octane, you dont need no fuel additive or cleaner.

I'd be interested in reading that because I don't believe it.

Additives in gas, only come in premium. Shell, Bp, Mobil have them for sure. Some gas does not, like Murphy Oil (Wal mart) These additives are all done, by the gas co. from the rail cars as they come in from the refineries. I used to manage a gas station in 1970's. Occasionally when my fuel tanker gas order would come in, the % of my order would be off. IE: more premium than mid grade, or not enough regular, etc. I had to decide whether or not to refuse it or more often than not I would ok dumping the extra % of ethyl or mid grade into the regular, and mid grade, but never the regular into mid grade or ethyl. When your selling 75-85,000 gpm, in the winter, and 135,000 in warm weather, you couldn't afford to run out.

The important thing to remember today is that the specs have changed dramatically since October 15, 2006. This is when the Ultra Low Sulfur Phase down happened. Many people know that the Diesel fuel went from 500 ppm down to 15 ppm max. However, very few people realize that the gasoline went from 130 ppm down to 30 ppm.

The gasoline you use in your car not only needs to cool your in tank pump, but also to lubricate it as well. Your in-tank pump needs a minimum (like tissue paper for the sole of your shoe) of 90 ppm while your injectors need a minimum of 75 ppm. Well guess what, you have 30 ppm. This is why a lot of the pumps are making excessive noise. Cooling is not lubricating. This is also why the injectors make the loud ticking sound that they do......no lubricity.

Now, add to that Ethyl Alcohol. Alcohol absorbs moisture and strips lubricity!! So basically your fuel is very dry and contains nothing to help seals stay conditioned and nothing for the life of the pumps or injectors.

This is why we designed the ACES IV the way we did. When you put the catalyst in the fuel, you get plentiful lubricity through the reaction of heat for pumps and injectors. Stock Car Racing Magazine quoted 600% less ring and bore wear using our product.

Also, we produce the amount of detergency that exceeds anything your 93 octane fuel gives you. The best that the gasolines have at the pump is a keep clean amount. Well, when your car gets dirty, it can't clean it up sufficiently and slowly but surely you are gaining more carbon and deposits. We have a detergency level that will get it clean again as well as keep it clean. Remember that there are a lot of people running the Predator and a 180 T stat. Dumping extra fuel for "performance" is going to have a negative effect on cleanliness.

It only makes sense to keep the volumetric efficiency you have and lubricate the system at the same time while producing more power and torque. Best of all worlds.

Regards,
Brian
BND Automotive LLC
440-821-9040
www.bndautomotive.com

lucas oil products - Page 2 Gasoli10

lucas oil products - Page 2 Stock_10

lucas oil products - Page 2 Stock_11


Enjoy!

Brian


Last edited by HiPwr on April 20th 2010, 9:15 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Fixed pictures.)
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Illinois Chaos
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Illinois Chaos

Location : in the other lane
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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeApril 20th 2010, 12:39 pm

Thanks for posting the info. I would guess that this is why it is critical in pu trucks to never go below 1/4 tank and allow the fuel to get below the pump. I found that out the hard way in the middle of Pigs But Iowa.
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5.7daytona
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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeMay 11th 2010, 7:10 pm

yes guys, Brian knows his stuff and if you want give him a call and he will gladly talk with you gusy with any questions or concerns that you guys have. Brain, i just joined this forum also , good to see you on here.
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370 Hemi
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Location : Sagamore Hills, Ohio
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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeMay 12th 2010, 7:38 am

5.7daytona wrote:
yes guys, Brian knows his stuff and if you want give him a call and he will gladly talk with you guys that have any questions or concerns that you guys have. Brian, i just joined this forum also , good to see you on here.

Thanks for the vote of confidence! Yea, the fuel is pretty crappy. This is why when doing data logging, you find KR sometimes, and then not others......inconsistent batches of fuel.

There are designed answers for these problems.

Great to see you here too!

Regards,
Brian
BND Automotive LLC
440-821-9040
www.bndautomotive.com
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Iguanaman
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Iguanaman

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PostSubject: Re: lucas oil products   lucas oil products - Page 2 I_icon_minitimeMay 12th 2010, 7:51 am

I can't imagine how I spend hours on the phone with you each time we talk.

Oh wait..THIS is how.

You da man, Brian!


370 Hemi wrote:
HiPwr wrote:
RIF. Reading Is Fun.

Well HiPwr,

We have just been approved as a new Vendor on this forum.

BND Automotive LLC.

The product that we were discussing earlier is the ACES IV Gasoline Formula.

I have been watching all the questions and answers on gasoline for our cars.

Many people on this forum are looking for more power without spending a lot more for fuel.

Before we can understand why ACES IV is important in your fuel, an appropriate understanding of "a few things" which determine what gives power in an engine :

We have to begin by understanding that all the horsepower our engines are ever going to produce are stored in the fuel that you use to produce it. All other components including intakes, cams, valves, compression ratios, computer tunes etc all are dependent on appropriate fuel(and lubrication).

It’s really that simple. The specific energy content of the air/fuel mixture and the length it burns is the key.

The more fuel energy your engine can EFFICIENTLY burn (read that utilize), the more power it will produce per given fuel charge. This is correct regardless of whether you are normally aspirated, turbocharged, or supercharged.

However, a lot of factors influence this fuel energy:

Gross volume, air/fuel ratio, density of the fuel mixture, completeness of vaporization as opposed to atomization, initial flame speed and WHERE the burn originates and how it swirls.

You’ll notice I didn’t mention the octane rating initially. The reason is that in and of itself, octane rating does nothing to improve power output!

All octane rating does is measure the ability of a fuel to resist pre-ignition (which differs from detonation which is caused by end gasses instead) in a higher compression engine.

Higher octane fuels allow the use of higher compression ratios, and THAT does produce more power. This is where the Diablo picks up some power because the engine can be tuned much closer to the compression ratio and it's utilization factor. ACES IV can advance the power even more using a Diablo as the fuel will reach longer power peaks. While an octane rating does influence flame speed, so do other factors.

Two of these other factors are:

Vaporization...this is just what it sounds like: how well is the fuel/air mixture dispersed at the point of ignition. (As ACES IV promotes molecular fuel balancing, a much more vaporized dispersed pattern emerges) Incompletely atomized fuel burns more slowly and mostly will not burn completely. (This is another the reason for 2 plugs in the Hemi)

It doesn’t do you any good if it isn’t completely consumed by the time the exhaust port opens.....(this is why ACES IV releases oxygen, hydrogen and nitrogen at exactly peak heat release for a much more complete burn before the exhaust stroke commenses.)

The better job you can do in getting a uniform dispersion of fuel in the incoming air, the more completely it will burn. This is also where ACES IV promotes ignition from the inside out which performs better than an outside in configuration.

Many people try to use oil based fuel additives to accomplish a better burn because they believe that it will reduce surface tension of gasoline, unfortunately petroleum oils commonly used in most all fuel additives have relatively high surface tension in solution with gasoline and so it actually inhibits the vaporization process hampering combustion. (Typically this is why people call most fuel additives "snake oil".)

Oil is the operative word here and why. Remember that if it is distilled out of crude oil and not included in either gasoline, diesel fuel, or jet kerosine, then it isn't good for the fuels in general and should not be added.

Gasoline, diesel fuel, and jet kerosine are the most expensive components and any refinery would love to make full barrels of these three with nothing left over. If the item is distilled out then it is not good for any of them. However, there are bottles of "petroleum distillate" additives available to put in fuels because essentially they have to get rid of them somewhere!!

Flame speed is also pretty self-explanatory, but there are two sides to this coin. On one hand, the faster the fuel/air mixture burns, the higher expanding gas pressure will be and the longer the pressure wave will have to work on the piston before the exhaust port opens.

However, since the ignition system is timed to fire before the piston reaches top-dead-center, some of that gas pressure will actually work AGAINST the piston as it completes the compression stroke. It is called “knock" in your regular car, but it's really pre-ignition and it can be really destructive.

It can literally chew the top of a piston away a little bit at a time. In less then a minute, at the RPMs that most street/strip engines run the top of the piston is gone and youre done. In extreme cases, pre-ignition can break pistons, and the damage that it can do is expensive.

The density of the fuel/air mixture is the subject of a great deal of interest throughout the racing world. The cooler the charge of fuel and air going into the engine, the denser it will be. And the denser it is, the more potential energy there is in each incoming charge. Introducing more available oxygen and hydrogen with the fuel creates more power yet in the given space.

Remember that all the horsepower you’re going to get is stored in that fuel and air (especially with ACES IV), so the denser a charge you can get into the engine, the better. Superchargers and turbochargers increase the charge density mechanically by compressing it, but that generates a lot of heat in the mixture before it ever gets into the cylinder.

This is why lubricity is so important in post combustion to exhaust phase. It creates even more heat if nitrous oxide is used as an accelerant. (ACES IV makes nitrous about 7% more powerful)

With ACES IV, lengthing the flame front and retarding peak heat release will cause the fuel to resist pre-detonation and allow you to lean the engine out more without damage. The heat reactive lubricity produced by the ACES IV will reduce ring and bore wear by some 600% while reducing stem and guide wear by some 360%.

Use of ACES IV in 87 Octane fuel has an ignition improver to help increase 87 up to a 96 Octane effect (for low performance applications only, and not for high performance R/T and SRT8 use) smoother running and more mpg and less heat are produced.

Using it in 89 octane (for R/T and stock SRT8 applications) produces up to 98 Octane effect, and in 93 Octane fuel, effects of up to 102 Octane can be attained. Any base fuel, when treated, will help eliminate cylinder detonation and produce added power.

I use 89 Shell or Marathon fuels and ACES IV at 1 oz per 6 gallons in my 2006 Charger SRT8 to use the 98 octane effect with smooth power and no detonation in HP applications.

This is what we used when we went to Akron Horsepower along with the 12.5w40 QuantumBlue oils to get 19 hp and 31 ftlbs of torque.

Understanding the dynamics of how fuels work will help many people determine what is the next move, and how to get more power from your fuel effectively and why we designed the ACES IV the way we did.

Thanks

Brian
BND Automotive LLC
440-821-9040
www.bndautomotive.com
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